Recruiting Updates

[kingaling42]

I think it's multi faceted of course.. but overall player improvement is the biggest thing that I look for personally, consistency is another top quality as I look at the Big South conference as a whole- you have to take into account that some kids simply work harder independently than others.. if you look at some of our best players that have come through UNCA, they all had a high level of personal drive to make themselves better, they accepted coaching most importantly.. Some kids don't accept coaching & their body language speaks volumes but I won't go there..

Now there are examples from previous players & some current players who have made few, little, or no strides to get better in terms of development, but overall our players are better each year they are in the program when there attitudes are in the right place- they are stronger, more skilled and show better production.. there are starters who have been complacent since they don't push themselves to get better thinking they're irreplaceable and there are players who don't play much who only want to blame the coaches for their shortcomings instead of using it as motivation to get better (we've all seen these dynamics for those that played at UNCA) - again overall I can list a ton of players who got better over the course of their careers.. I'm sure Alum & beachdog can relate most of the things I'm speaking about..

Given the $$ that UNCA has to offer, the current facilities that UNCA has provided to players/coaches alike, how could you possibly look at what is in place & truly expect Winthrop results? Additionally don't look at UNCA in a bubble- outside of Winthrop we are probably the 2nd most consistent & successful program in the Big South since 1997.. get over the fact that you don' like the coaching style- if that's the case then recruits/players have options to go elsewhere- I don't understand your personal beef with the coaches.. why don't you try being honest & share your specific thoughts other than some offensive play crap..

Given those ideas- most importantly for me personally is I want coaches who give it their all & really give a sh!t about my alma mater.. Yes I think our coaches fit that bill just fine- maybe moreso than any other group of coaches I've seen at UNCA since 1994 & we've had some quality coaches..

You also forget that this year's team could have been the regular season champs- 1 pt loss to CCU at home, Should have beat WU away, @HP, CSU in OT @ home were very winnable games- they are not the toughest bunch of players & I never knew you could coach that quality into people.. 3 of those very games were when we had some attitude concerns as well- so at what point do the players take that on themselves?

[ktrain]

My beef with the coaches isn't personal. I don't know them. Unlike your beef with Sean Smith, it's purely objective. Despite what you continue to profess on this web site, the coaches have no plan. They just throw the players out on the court and keep doing the same crap over and over again. There's little or no in-game strategy. The one instance where B actually did some coaching--against Winthrop, with 17 seconds to go and Asheville up by 3--he puts them in a zone! Winthrop, of course, hits the tying three, and Asheville loses in overtime. Nice job!

And consider the possible implications of that game: If Asheville had won, they'd have been the 3 seed. The way things might have worked out, Asheville could have hosted Winthrop in the finals. But we'll never know because Bfailed to do one of a coach' primary jobs: putting his players into position to win.

[kingaling42]

My beef with the coaches isn't personal. I don't know them. Unlike your beef with Sean Smith, it's purely objective. Despite what you continue to profess on this web site, the coaches have no plan. They just throw the players out on the court and keep doing the same crap over and over again. There's little or no in-game strategy. The one instance where B actually did some coaching--against Winthrop, with 17 seconds to go and Asheville up by 3--he puts them in a zone! Winthrop, of course, hits the tying three, and Asheville loses in overtime. Nice job!

And consider the possible implications of that game: If Asheville had won, they'd have been the 3 seed. The way things might have worked out, Asheville could have hosted Winthrop in the finals. But we'll never know because Bfailed to do one of a coach' primary jobs: putting his players into position to win.

If you want to point to that example, I agree that the zone was a bad idea in hindsight but you also have to conceed that Winthrop drew up a play for a guy who had made 2 3 pointers all year before he made that shot and finished 3 of 18 for the year in 3 pint shooting- JW would have been guarding him in man-to-man as DJ would have been on Buechert- JW was the same player who got caught on that very zone screen on that same wing.. so I don't know how many D1 coaches would have planned for that player to come off of a screen to shoot that shot.. Also we can talk about that adjustment since WU actually made that 3 pointer- but they were the absolute dead last 3 point shooting team in the entire country this year.. what defense do teams throw at teams that can't shoot?? C'mon man- let's not be Monday morning quarterback when the coaches played very good percentages & it just didn't work out..

No strategy?? How about the gap zone they threw at Radford the last 5-6 mins at home to seal that game? I'll give you one you'll appreciate how about the fact that they left Sean in games when he was shooting well & pulled his a$$ when he couldn't throw it in the ocean most games and let folks like Jaron Lane play- whether you like that or not you should at least conceed that it is an in-game adjustment based on that player's skills...

[ktrain]

There you go bringing up Sean again. Man, you have a hard on for him! Why? Did he embarrass your ass in a pickup game or something? Wait, I know what you're going to say: You can still take him, even at your age. Right? I almost forgot that you were a minor contributor to two Big South championship teams. (Translation: The team won the regular season title, but lost in the conference tournament. Big surprise!)

What the coaches should have done was sit the guys who were reversing the ball away from Sean. But that's another issue.

[kingaling42]

I only bring Sean up because you're so sensitive to every comment I make on him while I don't ever see you defend other guys that I have been far more critical of.. Players had to reverse the ball from Sean because all his defender had to do this year was stay in the passing lane (translation- we all could stay in the passing lane & keep him from getting the ball, it's not that hard)- he was never really a threat to cut backdoor or drive or even take a 1-2 dribble jumper- my knock on him is that he hurt the team as a one dimensional player when he's not shooting the ball well in games this year- that is somewhat subjective & clearly just my opinion... Being objective his senior campaign was the worse year he had at UNCA shooting wise & in which he had more 3 point & FT attempts than any of his previous 3 years.. I am being objective about all of this I assure you- I wish Sean had been all-world this year, because I am a Bulldog fan- but I also can call it what it is & he wasn't the same player this year despite more minutes played, more shots, etc.. I gave him credit in several games when it was due just like every other player, I also had no problem calling him out like any other player when he had his head up his a$$ in some games as well- let's not forget he was the lone senior & that means something to a team & was also lacking on this team for much of the year in terms of leadership.. Don't act like I just beat Sean down here all year- I will admit I bring him into play in responding to you though & will continue to do so until you actually defend someone else on the team.. I especially bring him up since you've acted in the past as if all we have to do is get this same struggling-to-shoot-the-ball player more shots to help the team out- I just don't see the logic in that criticism despite his potential to shoot the ball.. He was our best 3 point shooter, he also took the most 3 point shots- however that does not translate into running everything through a one dimensional player who happened to shot 37% from 3, 38% from the field & considering that UNCA had 7 other players who shot a higher FG % than Sean did this year- if he some other complimentary offensive skill that would be much more practical- but that's just not the facts- he is a shooter & that's really about all.

If I told you that Matt Morgan, Winthrop's center would have to hit 2 3-pointers in that game prior to the tip (he was 1-14 going into that game)- every single person here would agree that the odds are in our favor to win.. I know I would take that bet regardless of what defense we threw at them..

Anyways.. we did get a Verbal yesterday & it's a big time committment considering the exposure & attention this kid was getting- clearly could have gone higher than Big South but we'll have to wait til April for NLI & watch this HS junior go through all of next year before coming to UNCA in 2011..

[ktrain]

If you'll remember, I went after you in my first post for saying that dumb talk radio crap about Sean Hobbs. I've also questioned some of your criticisms about John Williams. Otherwise, I haven't had a problem with your criticisms of the players. If anything, I think you've been easy on most of them, as well as the coaches.

I didn't challenge the vast majority of your in-game criticisms of Sean. Having said that, I think the coaches didn't use him correctly. Sure, his shooting was off this year, but he was still their best three-point threat. How about the first High Point game: Asheville down by 3 with 22 seconds to go, B puts Sean back in the game. Does he get off a three? He never even touches the ball! First Primm misses a three, then Dickey misses one. Then, down by 4 points with 5 seconds to go, Asheville possession. Their only real chance would be if a player hits a three and gets fouled, right? So, in this instance, do they set a screen for Sean to take the final shot? Nope, he's the inbounder!!!! Pure Genius. But did any of you Einsteins on this site point this out?

Get all the recruits you want. They won't be put into position to win.

[GoUNCA]

Do you guys need to get a room?

Yikes. Who is ktrain a fan of again? I can't remember whether they are for Winthrop or for Radford. A sad fate either way, no doubt.

I'm not sure about all this criticism of Eddie. He has gotten a whole lot (relatively) out of people not expected to do anything at all (ie, Garrett Moles, Jason Ridenhour, etc. He makes bad coaching decisions sometimes, sure. But it is about the frequency of them. But, Eddie really doesn't get out coached that often during a game. We have guys take bad shots or not play defense too often, but it isn't always on Eddie. He has a loose style and I've grown to accept it to some degree. We can go after a more Type A personality when he retires if we want.

For the money he makes, Eddie is awesome. He is consistent and you couldn't ask for a better PR person. Any students with any contact with him nearly always agree that he is an awesome guy. He is practically a living legend. Everyone has a funny Eddie story. Personally, he taught me how to play squash. And beat me soundly while wearing oversized shoes he stole from one of the players. That intangible is pretty hard to replace.

Sean was a good player who hit some big time shots. He had some awesome games and he laid some goose eggs. Overall, a really good career and he will be a good alumnus. Not sure why his game is still being argued about. It makes about as much sense to argue about Sean as it does for me to still complain about Brett Warner.

[GoUNCA]

Oh, and I also meant to tell Cats to remember to check to see if their new recruits can understand the concept of zero since he is trying to help ours out.

It's not easy, but the Maya did it, so a WCU schooled person should (a lot to ask, I know). Zero timeouts. If you try to call for one when you have zero timeouts (effectively, you lack timeouts; they don't exist) you get called for a technical foul and the other team wins by two.

Direct Mr. Cole to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/0_%28number%29

[kingaling42]

Hobbs is still worthless so far as I'm concerned and at some point he needs to get motivated- that is entirely on him, I feel we'll never know though & he is wasting a scholarship as far as I can see it- he doesn't make the team better in practices/workouts/games with his energy or body language- he just sits there- critical or what not- there's just no tangible benefit to him being on the team.. I stand by my comments firmly.

I think that in late game situations the team relies on leaders to take over- the fact that you bring the HP game into play actually confirms to me that the team didn't trust Sean all year in that role which is pretty much my biggest knock on Sean as a senior- his lack of leadership... otherwise I can tell you that guys like Josh Pittman, Kevin Martin, Andre Smith, Bryan Smithson, KJ Garland, and others... would have the ball no matter what & that the team would make every effort to get them the ball as well to win or lose with that guy you trust in late game situations- the fact of the matter is that JP & Dickey seem to be the leaders of the team.. I don't think it's rocket science to see that those guys, especially being primary ball handlers had the ball in many late game situations not just that HP game alone for that very reason.. how many games did JP & Dickey win for us down the stretch of games with either key field goals or clutch free throws.. or should we exchange our 75/81% FT shooters for a guy shooting 63%?? They missed in the HP game & also in that same WU game you mentioned.. but how many others did they make those late game shots..

JW & Eric have the opportunity right now to become the leaders of next year's team.. I know that first hand, as you've pointed out I was a big time bench warmer but I also was a team co-captain in 1997 for a reason- I organized pick up games the spring/summer before that year, rode lazy players a$$es to get them into the weightroom & got the guys together for other functions & party's.. I didn't play hardly much that same year but I earned the respect of the guys I played with & helped to make our teams better most everyday- so you don't have to be a starter or be the next Josh Pittman to be a leader of the team- all you need is the heart, desire & love for your team to do the best with what you're given.. I will always have problems with talented players with no heart that act like they don't give a sh!t about my alma mater.. & they can come see me personally if they have a problem with that- I'm easy to find..

It would seem to me that as a member of this board & if you really had independent thoughts (because it seems you get your info from guys on the team that you defend here for obvious reasons)- that you would have shared those thoughts during game threads for conversation- not just spouting out some random moments from the season at this point in relation to a developing Verbal committment- As for the HP game you do realize that in many inbounds plays the inbounder is the guy that defenses tend to forget about & plays are many times designed for the inbounder to get the ball back, right? I'm not at all saying that the play was designed to do that, but either way sometimes scorers serve as great decoys- the bottom line is that that is not your call nor is it mine or anyone else's playing coach on the internet- Eddie has to live with his decisions & sometimes players have to actually believe in what they're doing, we know that some if not many had problems with plays/attitudes-.. that's fine I get it- you're friends with the folks you defend or whatever.. Players have choices, they can stay, play & commit to the system in place or they can move on.. you just can't have much success as a team if players are doing both.. that did happen early, we played poorly- but I know that some player's attitudes turned around in the season & it also corresponds with the success the team had thereafter.. Perhaps that is coaching too...

[ktrain]

First of all, I don't understand why anybody would want to waste their time talking on here during games. But, being the egotist you are, who thinks his blowhard opinions carry weight, I'm not surprised you spend so much time on here. Me, I just like to piss you off!

Second, I know you've said some dumb things on here, so these latest comments probably aren't the dumbest. But they're close. Sure, Primm and Dickey won some games. But how many did they and Stephenson lose with their low basketball IQs? If they didn't trust Sean it was up to the coaches to make sure that didn't matter. They should have been benched when they continued to freeze him out. The one and only time Sean had an opportunity at the end of a game was the first Coastal game. If you'll remember, he drained a three to give Asheville the lead with something like 30 seconds left. And you have no idea what kind of a leader Sean is. Whenever guys lost their cool on the court, who took care of it? He was the only player with a high basketball IQ. You could see him trying to teach, but it wasn't his fault that most of the guys were too dumb to learn.

Enjoy Asheville basketball's looming years of mediocrity.

[kingaling42]

You & Cats make me laugh John Wooden..

If you bench those same guys then a guy like Sean never gets the ball since we would have a hard time getting the ball across halfcourt moreless delivering the pass in a set play genius..

You do have to remember that we're talking about UNCA- we don't have All Americans at every position..

Some of us actually care about UNCA, if you don't why waste any time here?

[ktrain]

Oh, so the players dictate what goes on on the court???? What the hell are the coaches doing--babysitting?

This goes back to my original assertion that your coaches are useless. If the coaches did their jobs, the players would get the message. You're a moron.

[kingaling42]

That's the same logic that would have led to the coaches not encouraging Sean to come back last December..

Sean tried to be a leader at the end of the year when senioritis set in.. It was too damn late for all that.. The time is right now for JW & Eric.. Right now.. I know what I'm talking about in that regard..

Quit relying on what certain players tell you in regard to coaching.. Kids tend to appreciate their parenting after the fact.. Coaching is not all that different..

[ktrain]

You have no idea what you're talking about. Appreciating has nothing to do with it. Your coaches are weak and ineffective. They're the ones that should be in control. I don't rely on players to tell me about coaching. I know plenty of coaches. Good coaches. Real coaches. The kind that actually run their teams.

B stopped being a coach a long time ago, if he ever was. He's no more than a fund raiser and recruiter now.

[kingaling42]

As a former player for Eddie- 11 years removed & having watched every player come & go since 1994.. I know exactly what I'm talking about.. Don't get it twisted...

I will defend the coaches.. Coach B has some very obvious weaknesses & I have been outspoken in the past about rotations & lack of disciple; but he is listening to others around him that are more in touch & has changed his ways some which I give him credit for, I also know you're being generous by considering him to be a recruiter- you're way off base there! Fund raiser? Well anyone in that job would have to fill that role & could you honestly say that anyone would have done better??

I think you also forget where UNCA was coming from before Coach Wiel & Coach B got here, Don't be an idiot & not consider the history..

[GoUNCA]

I respectfully vote this pissing contest gets moved to its own thread and stops clogging up the recruiting thread.

[kingaling42]

I disagree (imagine that!).. I think that the conversation speaks to recruiting since coaching is the base of the discussion.. Don't get so wrapped up in the specific examples given to think this thread is off topic..

[ktrain]

History, at this point, has nothing to do with it. B's been there for 14 years. He's a terrible coach. Case closed.

Don't worry, GoUNCA. I'm finished here. There's no debating dingaling.

If I need a few laughs next year, I'll tune into a Bulldogs game.

Happy trails!

[kingaling42]

Without considering history then you're lost or think that Coach B has not progressed UNCA since he's been here the past 14-15 years.. You're completely ignorant to think that UNCA currently is the program it is other than what he has done.. Could it be more? Perhaps- but he has seen success here that UNCA & other Big South schools have not.. That also speaks volumes as well..

Peace!

[the cats]

There's no debating dingaling.

....and certainly no getting in the last word.....part of his psychoneurosis.

[kingaling42]

Jan. 30th Cats/WhatAJoke.. Jan 30th.. Stop being absolutely full of sh!t & then I may take you seriously- how's that new board Pu$$y.. Or have the ASU fans over run it with tonight's baseball loss? THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS... SOME THINGS WILL NEVER CHANGE...

Ktrain has no clue what it takes to be at UNCA as the head coach or even an assistant.. don't act like it's easy...

[beachdog]

*FACEPALM* Ktrain is an idiot.

[ktrain]

Beachdog, shouldn't you be humping someone's leg?

[GoUNCA]

Back to recruiting....

Short blurb about Hornsby committing to Asheville.

http://www.dailypress.com/sports/dp-spt ... 4300.story

[vabigpoppa]

sorry kingaling, your teammate theory didnt pan out

[kingaling42]

sorry kingaling, your teammate theory didnt pan out

Yep- I heard about that last night.. Speaking of panning out... what exactly was Lazar's contribution? Since he's leaving the country next month and not that he did much EXCEPT to pretty much ruin this year's RU team IMHO.. have Ali Ton to keep bringing in foreign kids that get homesick or have no loyalty- though Big Art was a big find for RU hoops.. that most recent committment fits that same description of being homesick right now & he's only in HS- after talking to folks, this is a good move for UNCA.. Good luck trying to change a few things with him..

[UNCA Alum]

Coach B has been here 15 years now.

4 regular season titles
1 tournament championship
10 finishes in the Top 4
4 straight Big South tournament semifinal appearances


UNC-Asheville has the smallest athletic budget and one of the league's worst gyms. From an academic standpoint, it is harder for us to get in recruits than any other school in the league. We have a hippy reputation which, outside of Hornsby, doesn't exactly help us with prospective recruits. It's 19 degrees outside for at least three months out of the year. Asheville's make-up doesn't exactly scream BASKETBALL POWERHOUSE, yet (as King mentioned) we have arguably been the second best program in the Big South over the past 15 years. Third at the worst behind maybe Liberty. We are going to once again be picked to finish second in the preseason next year.

And people are complaining about our coach? Seriously?

[beachdog]

Nice post. Ktrain, glad to see you have something other to offer than a mindless flame on the coaches/program.

[kingaling42]

Another junior in the works.. that last sentence is huge for us.. If he doesn't go bigger, we're in a good spot..

http://www.gastongazette.com/sports/ter ... layer.html

Alum- your boy Clyburn is going to Presby..

[DCF]

Here's a little clip that I found of Trent Meyer on youtube...Thought you guys might want to check it out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NZkZEgYbIzo